Sexiest Women...really?
I am so irritated by Digital Dealer's "Sexiest Women" issue. This type of rating system sets the industry back twenty years. We might as well be working at Hooters! Anyone else find this offensive? I know after 17 years in the industry I was hoping our work and accomplishments would be noticed first and foremost not our sex appeal. There really is no excuse for it and I am pretty sure it is illegal.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Sally Whitesell on
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Thanks Joe! Not sure how I missed that she was the author but I wil back up a little and double check the post. It almost makes it worse to think a woman would still think this is OK. By the way I don't know Ralph personally or professionally. This is all about an offensive article he choose to post.
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The title alone was offensive and degrading to all professional women who would prefer to be recognized for their accomplishments. Obviously they felt it was necessary to use such a title to get people interested enough to read the article. How sad! It really doesn't matter if a man or woman decided on the title, it was a poor choice to sensationalize a great article. The "sexy" factor never needed to be used to play up the amazing women featured.
Ralph Paglia said:
Craig, considering that each of the ten women wrote the section about themselves, and submitted the photo to be used, I would venture a guess that they approve of what they submitted to be published about themselves! If there is any pandering or grand-standing going in in regards to Fuschia's "Ten Sexiest Women" article and what each of the women wrote about themselves, it is from those who have commented in a judgmental manner without actually reading the article to learn that the list was prepared and published by a woman, and that each of the sections was written by the woman who is the topic of that session...
In my opinion, the negative commentary made about such an article tells us more about the ignorance that drives unconstructive polarization on important issues than anything in the article itself... Which is basically a celebration of women, written by a woman about ten ladies in marketing, including her own daughter, with each section WRITTEN BY THE WOMAN HERSELF!
Craig Lockerd said:Be interesting to see what the women that were picked in this stupid thing have to say about being picked?...Did they have a choice? Did they agree to it? How do they feel now? Maybe I'll wander over to ADM and make a comment! -
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Permalink Reply by Rebecca Chernek on
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The well-known poet, Maya Angelou, wrote something quite profound that I have never forgotten. “I’ve learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel.” It seems appropriate to remember it right now, after reading the growing discourse about whether or not ADM should have posted the article about the 10 Sexiest Women. It has revealed several interesting truths, especially about those who chose to comment. Not surprisingly, most of the blog responses were written by men. Some chose to be clever, flippant or comical; some became defensive when their original comments were challenged. A very few were able to understand what women in the industry feel after reading yet another article that focuses on the outer appearance of successful women.
I’ve been thinking about the issue all day and have finally decided to offer my perspective. As “Judy” stated, I am not offended by the article as much as being immeasurably disappointed. I work closely with men in the industry almost every day of the week and count many as friends who choose to value me for my expertise and genuine concern for their success.
It’s no secret that the automobile industry has been a male bastion for years. While great progress has been made over the years to include women into the sales force, the F&I office, in manufacturing, retail and even racing, some things remain the same. In some dealerships and other sectors of the industry, time has not erased the “good old boy” mentality. The operating word here is “some.” Great strides have been made, but challenges remain; barriers still exist. Over the past twenty years, I have worked hard, rising from obscurity to becoming a nationally known trainer of sales and finance managers. I consider myself a “pioneer” in the industry. No one would consider me a raving beauty, but no one who knows me could say I haven’t earned respect for my intelligence, industry savvy, tenacity, creativity, or teaching ability. Hundreds of dealership personnel nationwide have increased their bottom line profits, due to my expertise.
How truly sad and disheartening it is then—especially during this critical time in our industry when literally hundreds of personnel have lost their jobs, dealerships have closed, car lines have been discontinued, and profits are hard to come by for many—that space on ADM’s Web site was taken up by this particular article, and that so much time was spent by the article author on the focus of physical beauty, rather than purely on the accomplishments of the women selected. How sad that the photographs chosen were those that focused on the outer appearance of the women, in “sexy” poses, and not on a visage that showed inner character or professional demeanor. How much better and more inspiring it would have been for ADM have chosen ten women in the auto industry selected for an inspirational recounting of how these genuine industry “pioneers” broke into the male bastion and achieved laudable success because of their honesty, integrity, intelligence, and plain old-fashioned hard work. Did you know that of the 100 women chosen by Automotive News as leaders in our industry “nearly half of the 2005 Leading Women have left the business for jobs in other industries?”
What women am I talking about? Here are only a few that would have made a great article in ADM:
Jody Devere with Ask Patty
Pat Moran with Pat Moran & Associates
Lisa Schomp, a third-generation car dealer and owner-president of Ralph Schomp Automotive in Littleton, named one of the “100 Leading Women in the North American Auto Industry” by Automotive News.
Stacey Gillman Wimbish: President of the Gillman Companies, also designated by Automotive News as one of the "100 Leading Women in the North American Auto Industry."
Tammy Darvish: VP of DARCARS and owner of 4 Toyota dealerships, who recently joined members of Congress with other dealership owners to discuss the recently introduced Automobile Dealer Economic Rights Restoration Act of 2009. The legislation will restore the economic rights of automobile dealers in order to protect jobs, workers, and small business owners.
Sandy Fitzgerald-Angello: Vice President/Dealer Operations
Rebecca Chernek: founder of Chernek Consulting and CCI Learning Center, author of many journal articles on industry topics and renown menu selling training expert
Yes, I included myself on this list. I’ve earned the right. I’m determined not to become yet another successful woman who leaves the auto industry out of frustration of beauty over substance. Remember, Ginger Rogers did everything Fred Astaire did, but backwards and in high heels.
Sally Whitesell said:The title alone was offensive and degrading to all professional women who would prefer to be recognized for their accomplishments. Obviously they felt it was necessary to use such a title to get people interested enough to read the article. How sad! It really doesn't matter if a man or woman decided on the title, it was a poor choice to sensationalize a great article. The "sexy" factor never needed to be used to play up the amazing women featured.
Ralph Paglia said:
Craig, considering that each of the ten women wrote the section about themselves, and submitted the photo to be used, I would venture a guess that they approve of what they submitted to be published about themselves! If there is any pandering or grand-standing going in in regards to Fuschia's "Ten Sexiest Women" article and what each of the women wrote about themselves, it is from those who have commented in a judgmental manner without actually reading the article to learn that the list was prepared and published by a woman, and that each of the sections was written by the woman who is the topic of that session...
In my opinion, the negative commentary made about such an article tells us more about the ignorance that drives unconstructive polarization on important issues than anything in the article itself... Which is basically a celebration of women, written by a woman about ten ladies in marketing, including her own daughter, with each section WRITTEN BY THE WOMAN HERSELF!
Craig Lockerd said:Be interesting to see what the women that were picked in this stupid thing have to say about being picked?...Did they have a choice? Did they agree to it? How do they feel now? Maybe I'll wander over to ADM and make a comment! -
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Permalink Reply by NANCY SIMMONS on
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Bravo Rebecca!
I read Rebecca's statement this morning in facebook and was overwhelmed with her well thought out and eloquently stated commentary. I found it ironic, that when I clicked on the link to the dE story, it was blocked as my computer at home is safeguarded or child protected because the title included the word, "Sexiest". I actually wanted to share it with my 22 year old daughter and 16 year old son.
I, too, read the entire thread on ADM's site and had to chuckle at some of the justifications presented. I am no prude, however, I don't support the blend of "sexy" with highlighting a woman for her accomplishments. What next... "Sexiest Nobel Peace Prize Nominees"? In addition, the fact that the author of the article is female and works outside of the auto industry has no relevance to me, as this thread is not about pitting women against men.
Perhaps those of you who are not sympathetic to our strong passion here have not walked the last 20 or 30 years in our stilettos! I, personally, have spent 33 years in the retail operations side of the industry employed by 5 different dealerships over that span of time. Just to highlight a few of my experiences:
* As an 18 year old college girl, employed by a dealership as a Wholesale Parts Account Executive (that was what my business card read), I was coached to wear tighter skirts and higher heels to "get more accounts". They added, "If you want to be in the car business, get used to it."
* I was also told to stay away from the employee lounge as it was wall-papered with girlie cutouts... When I asked why they could not be removed... >"If you want to be in the car business, get used to it."
* I was the only female manager at a dealership back in the 80's and when the RedSox, Patriots, and Celtics tickets were passed around, I was always overlooked, but ironically, I was the only person in the dealership that had not missed a Celtics game on TV... When asked why, I was told that because I was a woman they didn't think I would want to go... >>"If you want to be in the car business, get used to it."
* I was told by a dealer once, that I had all the qualifications to be the GM for the new store he was acquiring, but didn't think I was strong enough... When I asked what made him think I lacked strength, he said, "You are so soft-spoken that you may not come across effectively when enforcing a policy or reprimanding someone."...>>"If you want to be in the car business, get used to it."
* Just four years ago, there was a big cookout at the dealership in a Friday afternoon. There were roughly 36 males and 4 females employed here, and sadly the 4 females were excluded from the invitation as it was a "Good Ole' Boys Club Gathering"...>>"If you want to be in the car business, get used to it.
Well, the fact is, I DO want to be in the car business, AND I will NEVER get used to it! Great strides have been made, but there is so much work left to be done! I created Carbucks, a group for automotive professionals to gather, and one of our main focuses there is to enhance the image of the auto industry to one of an esteemed and affluent profession it deserves! 630 fantastic Car guys and gals have joined and together, we can make a difference. I regarded this article as a "set back" at first, but now I see it for what it is...an oppurtunity for women like Sally, Rebecca, Jodie, Juanita, Jos, Sharon, myself and the many supportive gentlemen who jumped in to voice our frustrations.
I am not an accomplished entrepreneur, a CEO of an automotive industry-related company, but just a small town comptroller who eats, sleeps and drinks the car business...I have motor oil running through my veins, as it has been said, and I am passionate about women making a place in the industry! Perhaps if an overweight and unattractive woman with the same merit, had been included in the "Top Ten" list it would have made it more believable that it was their accomplishments which were found "sexy".
Sorry...I guess this thread has not been "put to sleep". -
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Thanks Nancy for acknowledging my response! It takes dedication determination to make the difference. I am proud of my accomplishment in the automotive business and I know we "have only just begun"! I also want to thank my dealer for giving me the opportunity to sell "trucks" when I was the only "female" ever hired to do it! Have faith and what's right will prevail! Have a coffee on me!
Becky
NANCY SIMMONS said:Bravo Rebecca!
I read Rebecca's statement this morning in facebook and was overwhelmed with her well thought out and eloquently stated commentary. I found it ironic, that when I clicked on the link to the dE story, it was blocked as my computer at home is safeguarded or child protected because the title included the word, "Sexiest". I actually wanted to share it with my 22 year old daughter and 16 year old son.
I, too, read the entire thread on ADM's site and had to chuckle at some of the justifications presented. I am no prude, however, I don't support the blend of "sexy" with highlighting a woman for her accomplishments. What next... "Sexiest Nobel Peace Prize Nominees"? In addition, the fact that the author of the article is female and works outside of the auto industry has no relevance to me, as this thread is not about pitting women against men.
Perhaps those of you who are not sympathetic to our strong passion here have not walked the last 20 or 30 years in our stilettos! I, personally, have spent 33 years in the retail operations side of the industry employed by 5 different dealerships over that span of time. Just to highlight a few of my experiences:
* As an 18 year old college girl, employed by a dealership as a Wholesale Parts Account Executive (that was what my business card read), I was coached to wear tighter skirts and higher heels to "get more accounts". They added, "If you want to be in the car business, get used to it."
* I was also told to stay away from the employee lounge as it was wall-papered with girlie cutouts... When I asked why they could not be removed... >"If you want to be in the car business, get used to it."
* I was the only female manager at a dealership back in the 80's and when the RedSox, Patriots, and Celtics tickets were passed around, I was always overlooked, but ironically, I was the only person in the dealership that had not missed a Celtics game on TV... When asked why, I was told that because I was a woman they didn't think I would want to go... >>"If you want to be in the car business, get used to it."
* I was told by a dealer once, that I had all the qualifications to be the GM for the new store he was acquiring, but didn't think I was strong enough... When I asked what made him think I lacked strength, he said, "You are so soft-spoken that you may not come across effectively when enforcing a policy or reprimanding someone."...>>"If you want to be in the car business, get used to it."
* Just four years ago, there was a big cookout at the dealership in a Friday afternoon. There were roughly 36 males and 4 females employed here, and sadly the 4 females were excluded from the invitation as it was a "Good Ole' Boys Club Gathering"...>>"If you want to be in the car business, get used to it.
Well, the fact is, I DO want to be in the car business, AND I will NEVER get used to it! Great strides have been made, but there is so much work left to be done! I created Carbucks, a group for automotive professionals to gather, and one of our main focuses there is to enhance the image of the auto industry to one of an esteemed and affluent profession it deserves! 630 fantastic Car guys and gals have joined and together, we can make a difference. I regarded this article as a "set back" at first, but now I see it for what it is...an oppurtunity for women like Sally, Rebecca, Jodie, Juanita, Jos, Sharon, myself and the many supportive gentlemen who jumped in to voice our frustrations.
I am not an accomplished entrepreneur, a CEO of an automotive industry-related company, but just a small town comptroller who eats, sleeps and drinks the car business...I have motor oil running through my veins, as it has been said, and I am passionate about women making a place in the industry! Perhaps if an overweight and unattractive woman with the same merit, had been included in the "Top Ten" list it would have made it more believable that it was their accomplishments which were found "sexy".
Sorry...I guess this thread has not been "put to sleep". -
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Permalink Reply by Juanita Kiesler on
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Becca, very well stated and you know I completely concur. I do want to take this opportunity to mention
social network sites allowed me to connect with like minded ladies. I knew other ladies with my
background existed and now we can communicate and help one another. Mentor those coming into the
industry we "Pioneer's" paved the way for. Let's celebrate our accomplishments and focus on future success.
Nice to meet you all! -
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Well put, Juanita... We do need to focus on the positives!
@Becky... Stop by for a coffee...Today's special... Cappucino, with a spoonful of business ethics, and two squirts of integrity...Only at Carbucks Coffeehouse... where it is "always on the house"!
Juanita Kiesler said:Becca, very well stated and you know I completely concur. I do want to take this opportunity to mention
social network sites allowed me to connect with like minded ladies. I knew other ladies with my
background existed and now we can communicate and help one another. Mentor those coming into the
industry we "Pioneer's" paved the way for. Let's celebrate our accomplishments and focus on future success.
Nice to meet you all! -
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So well said Rebecca! I have enjoyed hearing from all of you in this discussion so much. It has been very refreshing to know others feels the same as I about the industry and the strides taken and needed to keep moving forward. This isn't about conflict between men and women, it is about growth and mutual respect between everyone who works hard to be successful in a wonderful yet sometimes tough industry. Hopefully this discussion will help bring understanding and clarity as to where and when the line should be drawn.
I have worked hard creating and delivering training for service advisors and managers for over 17 years. I love watching them take a hard job and turn it into a successful rewarding career. Much of my focus is on relating and selling to female clients in service departments as it is a subject close to my heart. I have found that the only way to make a change is to point out the changes we need to make. Maybe this forum has given us the opportunity to do so.
I do not have plans to go anywhere. There is still work to be done! Thanks to all!br/>
Rebecca Chernek said:The well-known poet, Maya Angelou, wrote something quite profound that I have never forgotten. “I’ve learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel.” It seems appropriate to remember it right now, after reading the growing discourse about whether or not ADM should have posted the article about the 10 Sexiest Women. It has revealed several interesting truths, especially about those who chose to comment. Not surprisingly, most of the blog responses were written by men. Some chose to be clever, flippant or comical; some became defensive when their original comments were challenged. A very few were able to understand what women in the industry feel after reading yet another article that focuses on the outer appearance of successful women.
I’ve been thinking about the issue all day and have finally decided to offer my perspective. As “Judy” stated, I am not offended by the article as much as being immeasurably disappointed. I work closely with men in the industry almost every day of the week and count many as friends who choose to value me for my expertise and genuine concern for their success.
It’s no secret that the automobile industry has been a male bastion for years. While great progress has been made over the years to include women into the sales force, the F&I office, in manufacturing, retail and even racing, some things remain the same. In some dealerships and other sectors of the industry, time has not erased the “good old boy” mentality. The operating word here is “some.” Great strides have been made, but challenges remain; barriers still exist. Over the past twenty years, I have worked hard, rising from obscurity to becoming a nationally known trainer of sales and finance managers. I consider myself a “pioneer” in the industry. No one would consider me a raving beauty, but no one who knows me could say I haven’t earned respect for my intelligence, industry savvy, tenacity, creativity, or teaching ability. Hundreds of dealership personnel nationwide have increased their bottom line profits, due to my expertise.
How truly sad and disheartening it is then—especially during this critical time in our industry when literally hundreds of personnel have lost their jobs, dealerships have closed, car lines have been discontinued, and profits are hard to come by for many—that space on ADM’s Web site was taken up by this particular article, and that so much time was spent by the article author on the focus of physical beauty, rather than purely on the accomplishments of the women selected. How sad that the photographs chosen were those that focused on the outer appearance of the women, in “sexy” poses, and not on a visage that showed inner character or professional demeanor. How much better and more inspiring it would have been for ADM have chosen ten women in the auto industry selected for an inspirational recounting of how these genuine industry “pioneers” broke into the male bastion and achieved laudable success because of their honesty, integrity, intelligence, and plain old-fashioned hard work. Did you know that of the 100 women chosen by Automotive News as leaders in our industry “nearly half of the 2005 Leading Women have left the business for jobs in other industries?”
What women am I talking about? Here are only a few that would have made a great article in ADM:
Jody Devere with Ask Patty
Pat Moran with Pat Moran & Associates
Lisa Schomp, a third-generation car dealer and owner-president of Ralph Schomp Automotive in Littleton, named one of the “100 Leading Women in the North American Auto Industry” by Automotive News.
Stacey Gillman Wimbish: President of the Gillman Companies, also designated by Automotive News as one of the "100 Leading Women in the North American Auto Industry."
Tammy Darvish: VP of DARCARS and owner of 4 Toyota dealerships, who recently joined members of Congress with other dealership owners to discuss the recently introduced Automobile Dealer Economic Rights Restoration Act of 2009. The legislation will restore the economic rights of automobile dealers in order to protect jobs, workers, and small business owners.
Sandy Fitzgerald-Angello: Vice President/Dealer Operations
Rebecca Chernek: founder of Chernek Consulting and CCI Learning Center, author of many journal articles on industry topics and renown menu selling training expert
Yes, I included myself on this list. I’ve earned the right. I’m determined not to become yet another successful woman who leaves the auto industry out of frustration of beauty over substance. Remember, Ginger Rogers did everything Fred Astaire did, but backwards and in high heels.
Sally Whitesell said:The title alone was offensive and degrading to all professional women who would prefer to be recognized for their accomplishments. Obviously they felt it was necessary to use such a title to get people interested enough to read the article. How sad! It really doesn't matter if a man or woman decided on the title, it was a poor choice to sensationalize a great article. The "sexy" factor never needed to be used to play up the amazing women featured.
Ralph Paglia said:
Craig, considering that each of the ten women wrote the section about themselves, and submitted the photo to be used, I would venture a guess that they approve of what they submitted to be published about themselves! If there is any pandering or grand-standing going in in regards to Fuschia's "Ten Sexiest Women" article and what each of the women wrote about themselves, it is from those who have commented in a judgmental manner without actually reading the article to learn that the list was prepared and published by a woman, and that each of the sections was written by the woman who is the topic of that session...
In my opinion, the negative commentary made about such an article tells us more about the ignorance that drives unconstructive polarization on important issues than anything in the article itself... Which is basically a celebration of women, written by a woman about ten ladies in marketing, including her own daughter, with each section WRITTEN BY THE WOMAN HERSELF!
Craig Lockerd said:Be interesting to see what the women that were picked in this stupid thing have to say about being picked?...Did they have a choice? Did they agree to it? How do they feel now? Maybe I'll wander over to ADM and make a comment! -
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Permalink Reply by Shaun Gallagher on
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Hi although we have a fantastic all female 'Talent Recuritment' and 'Operational HR' team who are directly involved in the drive for new Sales Executives, we still only attract approx 10% of applicants that are female. I would be interested in any views or practical examples that you would like to share to help us attract more female applications to our business.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Baker on -
Shaun,
Unlike many other industrial business', as the Franchise Automotive business in both the Fixed and Variable operations, there exists an element in most Industrial segments an intensity of creating a culture of 'parity' of men and women. Even when there is a dominance of men in that 'culture', as stated by one of the participants of this long discussion thread above. Having been directly in the automotive franchise business for 25+ years, from lowest in opportunistic management positions, to the highest level of Management(COO & CEO), the participants of this thread know the opportunities that exist for many automotive franchised store(s) for improvement, as likely with other industrial businesses. Quite frankly, as Jody knows my sentiments and passion of wanting more women in our business, our franchises need to embrace and act on continual developmental training, with both Men and Women in the workplace together. As I said earlier, in parity or quite frankly, a non hostile environment. This all starts from the Top of the organization to the lower wage staff, at large! Ralph, as many have stated, is an upstanding individual who brings to most of us that savor becoming more 'knowledgeable', with applications in the automotive workplace is wanting to assist our Industry. Ralph,7 days a week will forward multiple great editorials from others. This thread of conversation that Ralph posted via a female editorial was perhaps his first over site in not realizing the controversy it created. And the lady that posted the editorial, semantically could be interpreted in many ways vs. her true conveyance. Again, via most editorial forwarding by Ralph, he deserves a break here as many above have stated of his 'true' character'. Ward's Cliff Banks, above, along with the primary editor of Wards-Steve F., are upstanding, very professional and astute in the automotive realm and have written numerous editorials on the upstanding presence of women in our franchised auto industry, as Ralph has forwarded many others. In my unbiased opinion via extensive experience with women in 'sales' in both variable and fixed operations, they overall are Fabulous and I would like to see at least 50% of the sales and service consultants be Women!!! Frankly, they maybe even better, in that 80% of car buying purchases are primarily influenced by women. To learn more 'ways and means' to 'hire/attract/retain Women in the workplace' come to Jody's(CEO of Ask Patty) workshop at AutoCon in Vegas Sept 5-8(BTW-that is chaired by Ralph Paglia) to learn from an expert panel of Women and Men on How to...('via the prior') .
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Yeah for Jody... and the cause- congratulations! Yes, it's about time!
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I find it so interesting that people feel passionate about this post almost two years after it was originally posted. This was never about persecuting one person or group of people. It was about the need for awareness and change in our industry. There are plenty of great female consultants and trainers out there ready to help you understand the female prospective in all aspects of the automotive industry. Let's be honest, we see things differently! After 18 years of performing this service in Fixed Operations I can honestly tell you we have made great strides but we still have a long way to go!
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